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Saved!"It's time for America to choose. You can have female emancipation and gay rights, or you can have Muslims."
"Western capitalist democracy gave women and gays equal footing in society. Islam is here to roll the clock back."
"This isn't terrorism. It isn't Islamism. It isn't extremism. This is Islam."
- @Nero (Milo Yiannopoulos) Twitter-
Saved!Husky WingEditing … Do you think muslims should be banned from the US? -
Saved!Gries HeEditing … fuck off already -
Saved!Gries HeEditing … Why am I still seeing this fucking dick's statuses even tho I already unfriended him months ago?
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Saved!Gries HeEditing … You ignorant fucking piece of shit.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … Heyhey, I disagree too, but I think a calm discussion would be much more effective.
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Saved!Gries HeEditing … delete your account
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … You're coming off similarly to many leftists who've adopted an illiberal mindset, afraid of debate and opposing opinions. That won't accomplish anything. It's more effective to fully understand one's viewpoint, and then respectfully state your own, countering each point you disagree with, in the hopes of changing their mind. (If it's disrespectful, then why would they want to listen to you?). I find that people who immediately resort to "shut up" or refusal of debate are those who can't defend their own viewpoints, or hold opinions with no basis in reality--and that's exactly the impression the other party might get, in which case you might be reinforcing their beliefs. Of course, right now, we both seem to hold the same idea, but with very different methods of expressing it :p
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Saved!DoubleagentEditing … >talking to gries like a civilised person (For the record I don't agree with Milo here) -
Saved!Not ImportantEditing … Husky you are bringing up lefties as an example of just saying "shut it k" but right wing politics have used it as a part of their rhetoric for a loooong time. It's their thing -
Saved!Husky WingEditing … You're right! However, I probably react differently to it on the left because, well, that's where I find myself on the political spectrum, so it bothers me more when people with similar beliefs hold such irrational mindsets. "Nonono I can't hear you"
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Saved!Rich .Editing … I tried to start a conversation when I saw Stealth's favourite politicians list looked a lot like my least favourite politicians list (Trump, Le Pen, Putin, Korwin Mikke). I don't think he's up for defending his views. Makes sense I suppose, they're pretty indefensible. @Not Important Personally I've seen people with all kinds of views get dismissive and self righteously unwilling to debate their views. As a generalisation I'd say those on the far left do it most to be honest though. -
Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I'm rich so I'd really want to be on the right because paying half my paycheck that I've worked p hard for is kinda bullshit, but I think I'm pretty much in the center. I want gays to be able to live like everyone else and I'm pretty cool with immogration. But taxation on entrepeneurs should be limited because that's how you build the Finnish economy up.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … I've heard that right/left on the political compass are mostly stand-ins for levels of economic control, and up/down (authoritarian/libertarian) standing in for levels of social freedoms. Could you be in the libertarian right? (I can't verify whether or not those claims were true). Honestly I can't imagine such a person fitting in with the american right, but maybe we're a strange place.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I'm adraid I'm not on the right. I mean, I voted for a lady that wanted a steeper tax curve, and I'm the one gettinf fucked for that. I think I'm a slight bit on the left and very liberal in my values.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … Left and right are useful for quick labeling sometimes but the idea that you can accurately place the entirety of someone's political views in a position on a one dimensional spectrum from left to right is only ever going to result in incredible generalisations. Same deal with liberal and authoritarian. Most people are inconsistently left wing/right wing or liberal/authoritarian depending on the issue. Some issues are more complicated than a left vs right or liberal vs authoritarian debate anyway.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … I gotta have a lot of respect for someone that's fine with getting taxed (or at least not viciously against it). Somewhat of an issue here in the US, people don't seem to understand that we need taxes to fund social benefits :p
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Saved!DoubleagentEditing … Left and right is defo not inherently linked to authoritarian/libertarian. You can see crazy examples of authoritarianism on both sides. Being an authoritarian is linked to being a crazy asshole and nothing more.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … I guess economically I'm a centrist (By UK standards. That probably makes me a bit left wing by US standards and a little right wing by Scandinavian standards). Socially I'm usually pretty liberal. As I say though, those labels are shallow. Knowing I'm a centrist liberal only lets you guess at my views on most issues, it doesn't tell you them.
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Saved!StealthRUSHEditing … @Gries He https://i.sli.mg/XBgMbR.gif -
Saved!Not ImportantEditing … Husky, believe me, I'm not crazy about paying those taxes. And I'm not crazy about the fact that when I inherit my wife 43% of it goes to the government. But that's how it has to be. At least my kids get education and healthcare and all that jazz with the money, and so do a ton of others.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … Oh yes Rush, that's what people are doing. We are just shouting RACIST at you
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … I feel you. No one likes losing money, and those sound like incredibly hefty taxes.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … Deleted by himself
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Saved!StealthRUSHEditing … @richardpale if you are genuinely interested I gladly would elaborate my choices of favorite politicians.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … @StealthRUSH Right now, there's no debate for us to be losing, you haven't made your case so we're kind of winning by default. By all means enlighten us as to why we should all support Trump/Korwin Mikke/Le Pen/Putin etc. I honestly can't get my head around why people support those guys so I am curious and my counter arguments'll be civil.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I'm not sure who I'm most interested about, maybe Korwin-Mikke since he is just such a fucking loony.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … I'd definitely like to know about Trump and Putin
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Saved!Wrl6199Editing … So are notifications back because I wanna see stealth's response -
Saved!Husky WingEditing … Pape said "fuck it, E3's on. Four more days!"
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Saved!Wrl6199Editing … *sigh*
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I want this discussion to go on.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … I'm most curious about why Stealth ranked Putin. Even on a list with Trump/Le Pen/Korwin Mikke/Farage/Orban etc an ex KGB corrupt Russian autocrat and war criminal sticks out like a sore thumb.
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Saved!StealthRUSHEditing … I applaud conservative Nationalist politicians. a limited character chat ins't the best place to discuss in-depth politics.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … Good old chatango? http://favslist.chatango.com/
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Saved!Rich .Editing … There's no character limit on these comments but if the lack of paragraphs is bugging you we can always take it to the forums: http://www.favslist.com/forums/Political-Alignment-303
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Saved!Rich .Editing … What is it you find appealing about nationalism though? I'm guessing it can't just be a sense of American patriotism/belonging since you admire foreign nationalists from various European countries as well. The static identity politics, rejection of cultural exchange and us and them divisiveness never bothers you? As for conservatism, you mean social conservatism? I'm always curious when someone tells me they're a social conservative just how far they'd like to wind the clock back or whether they're just against social change until it's already happened and then they're fine with it.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I'm kinda interested on knowing what's your take on gay marriage/adoption? Also, are you a racist?
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Saved!Rich .Editing … Not sure you're ever going to catch anyone out by asking "Are you a racist?" @Not Important, even the KKK says no to that question nowadays. I'm curious whether Stealth totally rejects multiculturalism or if he accepts that America's always been a cultural melting pot with freedom of religion enshrined in its constitution?
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I've met some peop
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … Met some people who identify as racist, I wanted to hear his thoughts on it, even though I don't think he is a racist. What are Rush's thoughts on religion? Should muslims be banned from entering rhe US? What about the Trump Wall, is it a good idea? Many things I want to know
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … Kinda sad that he didn't explain his thoughts, I was looking forward to a little debate and maybe a sharing of views
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … Banning any group from entering the US would go against the first amendment, wouldn't it? Banning people for their ideologies (and not all muslims hold the same ideologies, just like most christians don't fit the westboro baptist church)
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I've heard supporters of these kinds of politics talk about it seriously, so I wanted to ask it.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … The curiosity must be satisfied.
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Saved!FincherEditing … "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" It wouldn't be prohibiting the free exercise of religion. People inside the country could still practice Islam, and people outside the country could as well, but they would be practicing it out there instead of in here. I don't think the Supreme Court would overturn it. -
Saved!Retro WolfEditing … Milo is my hero. -
Saved!Not ImportantEditing … Milo is an oblivious cunt
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Saved!Retro WolfEditing … Him and trump are a fantastic threat to the regressive left. The media and the world in general are consumed by the views of the left and finally someone takes a stance against it. I'm all for it, to be frank, seems like a nice change of pace. I've been in support of the right for years, and people like these are the holy grail in comparison to the slimes we have in politics today. Milo and Trump will give you the cold hard truth, and this truth is evidenced by Islamists themselves, unfortunately.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … The problem with both of them is that they spout a lot of reactionary bullshit, which the other side of the coin is guilty of too. However, when you criticize the lefties, it makes you a whole lot more credible if you don't make huge sweeping generalizations and reactionary bullshit tweets like "As a homosexual, the scariest words you could hear are 'Allahu akbar'". Also their rhetoric which is pretty often something like "You disagree with me = You are wrong" is just idiotic. They are populistic and oversimplify things to create commotion, which I've never been a fan of.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … Trump giving the truth? The one who lied since the start of his campaign, saying that his campaign was self-funded? Or the one who publicly denies climate change, claiming it's a chinese conspiracy, but in an application to build a wall around his golf course, acknowledged that climate change is "dangerous"? Was there any truth in him saying all mexicans are rapists? What truth does he give us? He's claimed that he can't be bought, but he's received hefty corporate donations, and the GOP's warmed up to him since realizing that he *can* be bought.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … stfu @Husky Wing you liberal cunt fucking left wing fagogt
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … @Retro Wolf what are your thoughts on Vladimir Putin?
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Saved!Retro WolfEditing … couldn't give less of a fuck about Putin, to be honest. I don't see him as the evil man that others do, though.
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … What about his war crimes, tampering of democracy, silencing of all opposition, basically using a puppet for him when he wasn't legally able to be a president and all that. I think those are the reasons people see him as an "evil man"
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … And I'm also interested by you thinking that Trump is giving the truth when he has been caught lying time and time again.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … @Retro Wolf You think Donald Trump gives "the cold hard truth"? The same Donald Trump who said there were thousands of Muslims celebrating in New Jersey when 9/11 happened? Who pretended not to know who the head of the KKK was when he was accepting his endorsement? Who shared false racist crime statistics about blacks killing 81% of white homicide victims? Who makes up his own immigration and unemployment statistics? Who showed a video of a riot in Morroco and claimed it was Mexican immigrants storming the border? Who claims Obama was born abroad? Who claims he vocally and clearly opposed Iraq from the beginning? Who claimed Ted Cruz's father was with Lee Harvey Oswald before JFK was shot? Is that the Donald Trump you're talking about?
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Saved!Rich .Editing … Even putting aside for a second the debate about how abhorrent his views are Donald Trump is a pathological liar. It's a pretty distorted perspective to say that "the media and the world in general are consumed by the views of the left". The reality is that there's no conspiracy and there's a whole spectrum of views ranging from far left to centre right that are all just "the left" to you because you're on the conservative hard right of the political spectrum.
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Saved!Retro WolfEditing … I see trump as more of a political icon than anything. Yes, he's not the smartest person running for the presidency and yes, some of his views don't correlate with mine but as a figure of open speech about the west's major problems there is no better than trump. It's either trump, or bernie sanders who will literally drop dead during one of his own speeches or hillary clinton, who is just a straight up lunatic, to the point where she made made sure China, North Korea and Russia were up to speed on americas National Security secrets. On the topic of trumps "lies", they are all things that nobody would give a fuck about if it wasn't trump saying them. All politicians lie, however with trump its somehow more personal when it's coming from a person you dislike. The climate change thing is laughable, and he isn't completely self-funded, thats true, he does get donations from people who choose to do so, and he credits them appropriately.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … *figuratively
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Saved!Retro WolfEditing … Also I will have to look more into Putin's history as prime minister/president, since I'm probably missing a lot of info. Also Also, where are my right winged people? Seems like we're quite the minority here.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … A few hours ago you were saying Trump gives us the cold hard truth. I'm guessing you've realised you can't defend that so you've fallen back on the "all politicians lie, he's no worse than the rest" schtick. Thing is, he is worse than the rest. Can you find me any other respectable politicians with lies equivalent in magnitude to Donald Trump's lies? Can you name any respectable politicians who've made up events that never happened involving thousands of people related to 9/11 for the sake of a racial smear? How about a respectable politician that's tried to implicate a rival's family member in the most famous assassination of the 20th century? Can you name a respectable politician who's claimed an elected President was secretly born in Kenya and hence ineligible to be President?
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I'm actually pretty right wing. Voted right wing in Finland and support state immensely. Putin is just scum, Trump is a fool and I don't like populism. And Milo is wrong about so many things and purposefully polarizing just for the RT's
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I truly dislike populism. How on earth does it work? Right wing, left wing, most populism annoys me greatly.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … I follow the Husky Wing.
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Saved!Rich .Editing … What do you mean by populism @Not Important? I've always found the term pretty meaningless. I've been called it a few times before, it seems to be a go to insult when someone doesn't like that I'm eurosceptic.
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Saved!Husky WingEditing … He might be referring to a mob mentality, or a collective shunning anyone who's the "other." "Oh, you're... different?"
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Saved!Not ImportantEditing … I'm referring to politicians who use huge sweeping ignorant comments and talka a lot about "the people" and always know what "the people" think. Stuff like "The scariest word a homosexual can hear are 'Allahu Akbar'". You know, a lot of chants and all that. Little true substance and a lot to complain about but no real alternatives. Calling eurosceptism populism is dumb. I feel like populism refers to something different in Finnish, maybe it's a broader/not as clear term in English?
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