• Filly Vanilli Filly Vanilli
    Filly Vanilli ► Horizon: Zero Dawn
    8 years ago
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    omfg Sony.
    • Papissama
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      Papissama
      Editing … damn corporate people...
      8 years ago
    • Gries He
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      Gries He
      Editing … What exactly am I supposed to get outraged over here?
      8 years ago Heart 2
    • Dr Eggnog
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      Dr Eggnog
      Editing … If they think gamers are that silly why do they even want to make games for them?
      8 years ago
    • Filly Vanilli
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      Filly Vanilli
      Editing … I think the article speaks for itself, Gries
      8 years ago
    • Pudding
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      Pudding
      Editing … Everybody is thinking and doing it (btw not exclusive to the game's industry), but Sony is the first one to say it and we should direct our anger at Sony? Personally, I find it stupid, but I don't get everyone's shock? Also, Sony, above everyone else is the one that pushes gender equality the most and featured female characters in prominent or lead roles the most in their games. From a business perspective, let's not bullshit ourselves, this was a risky move, considering they're promoting this as a new AAA franchise in the action genre which is populated by dudebros. Personally, I think it's a bold move and Guerrilla Games should be commended for sticking to their guns, while Sony should also be commended for letting them do it in the end. Them being slightly apprehensive and do focus testings, given all the factors involved, is normal. Them speaking up about that fear is, quite frankly, refreshing and could help the industry (because they shouldn't be afraid) and yet they get blasted for it instead of being reassured? Nice.
      8 years ago Heart 3
    • Filly Vanilli
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      Filly Vanilli
      Editing … Sony doesn't need to be coddled. Treating the existence of women in your product as some big, scary, threatening thing contributes to the "othering" of women in what is already a male-dominated hobby, and pointing out as much isn't ~blasting~ the company. On the contrary, it's completely warranted. Or, you know, tell women how to feel about being microaggressed and treated like outsiders being reluctantly welcomed to the Cool Kids Table. That's cool too.
      8 years ago
    • Filly Vanilli
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      Filly Vanilli
      Editing … For all the assertions gamers in general like to make about sexists being the "vocal minority" in the gaming community, the same gamers sure DO like to pull out said sexists as a silencing tactic when a woman is complaining about how they feel a company is being harmful. "Don't let sexists discourage you, they're far outnumbered by all of the Nice Guys in the gaming community!" then, in the same breath: "Sony was completely right to be so apprehensive about acknowledging women's existence by giving them representation--just think of all the DUDEBROS out there! That could really hurt their sales!!"
      8 years ago
    • Filly Vanilli
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      Filly Vanilli
      Editing … The fact that people are getting mad at me and the author for simply pointing out the fucking absurdity of it all boggles the damn brain.
      8 years ago
    • Pudding
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      Pudding
      Editing … The thing is, you and the articles the likes you've posted, aren't just ''pointing'' it out (italics and coming to the their own dubious conclusion out of things the person said? [who ever said guys were afraid? plus who made you the representative of every single male?] or the simple 4 lettered acronym? nice.). Numbers speak for themselves and the businessmen go by the numbers, like it or not. When Epic included the female squad mate, do you not think there were a shit ton of focus tests done? They just didn't say it. Sony was open about it. Better articles should be written about this topic as well as statements that actually bring something to the discussion, instead of closing it off from the get go.
      8 years ago Heart 1
    • Filly Vanilli
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      Filly Vanilli
      Editing … What does that first sentence even mean? If we aren't simply pointing out the absurdity, what exactly are we doing? Because from where I'm standing, the article is saying that women's existence needs to be normalized, not be treated as a reluctant concession and prefaced with hand-wringing and pearl-clutching.
      8 years ago
    • Rich .
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      Rich .
      Editing … In all fairness it's worth remembering this isn't a case of Sony being sexist and not wanting to publish a game with a female lead, it's a case of Sony being totally happy to fund a game with a female lead but wanting to know it was good business to do so because they feared a chunk of the game's potential audience/society as a whole might for whatever stupid reason be less likely to buy a game with a female protagonist. Yeah, it's a bit disappointing to hear they're not principled enough to think "it's 2015, this should be a non-issue" and green light a female protagonist as quickly as they would a male one but I understand that Sony are a business and are inclined to worry about anything - including very dumb things - that affects their sales and I'm glad that after they did the market research they came to the right conclusions. Now let's just hope the game's good.
      8 years ago Heart 3
    • Pudding
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      Pudding
      Editing … ''Aren't just'' =/= ''aren't''. And I've stated in the brackets what I meant by that. You're setting the tone (as well as the article) of this discussion and that tone isn't the thing that will help a discussion grow. At least not in a beneficial way.
      8 years ago Heart 1
    • Filly Vanilli
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      Filly Vanilli
      Editing … Richard, I wasn't even saying or implying Sony was being sexist. The article even says this looks like an interesting game and it's good that there is a female protagonist, two things which I agree with. But we can acknowledge those things while also pointing out that the rhetoric I describe in my above comments is harmful and could be better approached. "Blasting the company" just seems such a disproportionate interpretation of what was originally done here. But I should have known better than to think I could post something nuanced about a company's treatment of women on here without getting jumped on. Btw, "other companies are thinking it but not saying it!" is a cop out. Those companies are morally obligated to think about the implications of their actions, too. This particular instance is what happened to pop up on my twitter feed today. Tomorrow it may be someone else. But wrt "Sony is just the only one saying it," there is also merit in the adage that some things are better left unsaid.
      8 years ago
    • Filly Vanilli
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      Filly Vanilli
      Editing … "Aren't just" = "aren't simply." I read your bracketed comments, but I guess your syntax threw me off because I didn't really understand what you were trying to say (clearly). Whatever though, I don't care anymore. Leave me alone.
      8 years ago
    • Rich .
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      Rich .
      Editing … I can appreciate the nuance. Sony aren't sexist but at the same time they're not going out of their way to be a small part of the solution and normalise women being prominent in the stories games tell. As I said the ideal stance for a publisher to have would be green lighting female leads with no extra consideration compared to male ones because it's 2015 and this should be a non issue whereas Sony's apparent stance of "we're happy to publish a game with a female lead as long as it makes just as much profit as it would if we published it with a male one" whilst understandable from a pragmatic business point of view is pretty cold and valueless. I don't think the story makes Sony seem terrible - they won't be the only company with that kind of decision process, they are first and foremost a business so how overriding any moral duty about cultural representation of women should be on their creative decisions is debatable and they made the right call in the end - but it does make them seem like they lack strong values and it reflects poorly on our society that businesses worry about their audiences being sexist and are willing to work around that.
      8 years ago Heart 3
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